I didnt like the limited durability but I DID love how you could craft every single piece of your weapon to suit your combat style...wanted a high rate of fire? Craft the spring thingy so the weapon cycles faster...More damage? Better barrel. Elemental weapons where interesting additons too, along with all the cool modules. THe beta weapon crafting with the module/elemental system could seriously open up an endless variety of weapon and ability combinations.
Likes:
Beerdog6
OK, I have to chime in here. The dura/craft balance in 0.6 was one of, if not the best, I have ever seen. I hate crafting. It sucks. It is so boring. But 06? I spent literal days crafting stuff just to eke out one more erg of power on that gun.
Those who said their stuff breaks too fast? Well, I never had something break faster than I could replace it. My main request is no goddamn character binding equipment please. Because hey, When I pick up my mobile phone it doesn't glue itself to my hand for all time.
Those who said their stuff breaks too fast? Well, I never had something break faster than I could replace it. My main request is no goddamn character binding equipment please. Because hey, When I pick up my mobile phone it doesn't glue itself to my hand for all time.
Likes:
Krhys and Wintersiege
It did get in the way of having fun at times. If I have to stop to think about my gears durability or maybe not go play with friends in order to thump for resources to fix my gear, it takes away some of the fun of the game. Early on exploiting was the reason many had huge stockpiles of resources built up which screwed with the stats enough that it was one of the reasons they thought the requirements needed to be increased.
I am not a fan of decaying gear. I tolerate it in games that keep the emphasis on fun. When they put the emphasis on the economy it tends to get in the way of fun.
I am not a fan of decaying gear. I tolerate it in games that keep the emphasis on fun. When they put the emphasis on the economy it tends to get in the way of fun.
If that is the case, then doesn't it invalidate the need for it to begin with? It would have no effect regardless, so adding it to the game added nothing but development time.
Calldowns would have been a better option in my opinion but like many things with the game, changes were made when sometimes the original vision was better.
Calldowns would have been a better option in my opinion but like many things with the game, changes were made when sometimes the original vision was better.
Not really. It's like making sure you don't run out of gas IRL (for someone who lives in the suburbs near the city), but even easier since jet durability didn't go down very fast and if you died and lost 10% durability, you'd more than likely spawn next to a garage to do repairs. It didn't add anything to gameplay except for a reason to stop using gear that was beyond repair. That is, excluding bugs that made broken gear more useful than normal gear.
Likes:
NitroMidgets and Ronyn
The problem with Red5 was the fact that they tried to directly copy the SWG system without knowing what they were doing. They put in the systems but they were half assed.
There is a reason SWG has been pretty much universally accepted as the best sandbox ever made. Its crafting / economic system was the best in any game to date and its not even close. Relying on other players is an intricate part of a successful game. If you can do everything yourself, you end up with no reliance and pretty much a single player game. You have no player interaction.
Having Crafting Classes , "Entertainer/Buffer" Classes, and Combat Classes forms a circle of need.
Crafters make items for combat class. >>>> Combat classes uses armor / weapons / food, etc to kill mobs / players >>> Combat Players encounter strong mobs that they need buffs for >>>> Entertainers / Buffers craft buff packs that help combat classes kill stronger mobs. >>>> Combat classes kill stronger Mobs, they Drop attachments / special components used in crafting recipes (these arent unlimited. 2 drop, 2 are used in the crafted items, varyaing stats everytime they drop). >>>> Combat Classes weapon breaks >>>> Combat Class takes specially dropped compontents to Crafter Class to make them better gear to replace their broken items. >>>> Start the cycle over again
This is a perfect economic / social cycle. Without dependency on each other, you end up with WoW, where you are sitting your garrison / city mashing your nuts with zero to do.
There is a reason SWG has been pretty much universally accepted as the best sandbox ever made. Its crafting / economic system was the best in any game to date and its not even close. Relying on other players is an intricate part of a successful game. If you can do everything yourself, you end up with no reliance and pretty much a single player game. You have no player interaction.
Having Crafting Classes , "Entertainer/Buffer" Classes, and Combat Classes forms a circle of need.
Crafters make items for combat class. >>>> Combat classes uses armor / weapons / food, etc to kill mobs / players >>> Combat Players encounter strong mobs that they need buffs for >>>> Entertainers / Buffers craft buff packs that help combat classes kill stronger mobs. >>>> Combat classes kill stronger Mobs, they Drop attachments / special components used in crafting recipes (these arent unlimited. 2 drop, 2 are used in the crafted items, varyaing stats everytime they drop). >>>> Combat Classes weapon breaks >>>> Combat Class takes specially dropped compontents to Crafter Class to make them better gear to replace their broken items. >>>> Start the cycle over again
This is a perfect economic / social cycle. Without dependency on each other, you end up with WoW, where you are sitting your garrison / city mashing your nuts with zero to do.
Thanks for answer. So Warframe go for way with lots of horizontal progression 
Now compare that to the new player's gear. It might not look much at face value, but it's orders of magnitude better thanks to Damage 2.0 The new player is also locked out of the higher tier content (unless taxi takes you there) because most people wouldn't survive long anyway.
Your gear will only become obsolete when something better comes out, or the old stuff gets balanced downwards. Forums can be full of salt at times. Not that obsolete is the right term, as it will still carry you far. It's just that there's something far better now. The meta is always a moving goalpost.
I dont think gear degradation should be in a game. it becomes just another (imo) tedious mechanic that would detract from the enjoyment the game experience overall. I have to maintain and fix things here in rl and its annoying and something I wish i could just skip.
Likes:
NitroMidgets
Red5 actually tried to do that. Version 1.0 release crafting was intended to limit what an individual could craft. The player base went nuts on the forums and revolted over the idea. So people got grandfathered into the system and you now had newer players being second rate citizens because of it. Not that it mattered as crafting ended up taking a back seat to the far superior item drops.
Red5 wasn't the problem. The players were the problem. They had already been spoilt for choice. They didn't want the range of gear they could craft taken away.
If crafting gets added to Ember at some point, there needs to be a limit to how much you can craft from the very beginning. And regular milestone wipes across the board throughout any kind of alpha/beta.
Red5 wasn't the problem. The players were the problem. They had already been spoilt for choice. They didn't want the range of gear they could craft taken away.
If crafting gets added to Ember at some point, there needs to be a limit to how much you can craft from the very beginning. And regular milestone wipes across the board throughout any kind of alpha/beta.
Good discussion...what about perma gear (with repair cost)...and modifications that wear out with use (active game time - mining/killing bugs/etc; not socializing at the bar). Gear and mods crafted with resources of varying grades (low/mid/high/very high/epic/legendary). Better grade perma gear lengthens the time before modifications wear out. Better grade mods last longer AND adjust gear stats. Just one player's thoughts...
Likes:
Cadbane
There are other solutions to add resource demand, there is no need to implement something so unfun and backwards as maximum durability
I remember spending hours in firefall trying to find the purple quality minerals i needed to make another gun as good as the one i had before it broke permanently, it was not fun at all
I remember spending hours in firefall trying to find the purple quality minerals i needed to make another gun as good as the one i had before it broke permanently, it was not fun at all
Well, this is my two cents. AS a casual, mostly solo gamer, I liked the basic crafting system in FF, then it started getting harder and weirder. If crafting is too hard, it will drive people away. But the basic idea of different materials
affecting stats differently is great. Also having some type of economy where someone who likes to craft can produce for others that like to fight, or gather resources would be great. You can also have the "CORP" buy and sell different things and use that to help regulate the economy.. Microtransactions perhaps?
As far a durability, there should be some kind of penalty for engaging in combat, getting hit and taking damage.
Otherwise it is just another shooter. But having decay is not good. That being said. I could see some kind of upkeep
or maintenance on some things. Cars need tires. Barrels in rifles and cannon wear out. And higher quality things don't wear out as fast. So basic gear, cheap, easy to use, wears quickly. Expensive gear, Durable, more accurate, maybe more skill to operate effectively
And there should be some type of skill level for crafting. anyone should be able to program the basic setting on a 3d printer, but say unlocking Tier 2 or Tier 3 plans requires some knowledge and practice.
Just as there should be some kind of knowledge bonus for different weapons. Anyone can pickup a rifle and point it and shoot, but not everyone can set a mortar properly, or read the reticle on an SVD( soviet sniper).
affecting stats differently is great. Also having some type of economy where someone who likes to craft can produce for others that like to fight, or gather resources would be great. You can also have the "CORP" buy and sell different things and use that to help regulate the economy.. Microtransactions perhaps?
As far a durability, there should be some kind of penalty for engaging in combat, getting hit and taking damage.
Otherwise it is just another shooter. But having decay is not good. That being said. I could see some kind of upkeep
or maintenance on some things. Cars need tires. Barrels in rifles and cannon wear out. And higher quality things don't wear out as fast. So basic gear, cheap, easy to use, wears quickly. Expensive gear, Durable, more accurate, maybe more skill to operate effectively
And there should be some type of skill level for crafting. anyone should be able to program the basic setting on a 3d printer, but say unlocking Tier 2 or Tier 3 plans requires some knowledge and practice.
Just as there should be some kind of knowledge bonus for different weapons. Anyone can pickup a rifle and point it and shoot, but not everyone can set a mortar properly, or read the reticle on an SVD( soviet sniper).
Game like this has to have durability. I remember all the bitching about it in FireFall, but people just don't understand how much harder it is to make a fun game when stuff doesn't break. Because eventually, probably sooner than later, majority of players will have top notch stuff, and that will be that, than they will sit and complain how they have no goals, how they got top gear and there is not much to play for.
There should be slow rotation of resources in this game to keep the gameplay going. We dig resources up, we build things, we use that to dig more resources to build bigger things. There got to be a break somewhere in this ideology, otherwise we are going to hit wall very very fast, especially with a game that is planning on been crowd funded.
Stuff needs to break, stuff needs to be destroyed by the enemies, that will slow down the "top gear" wall. Devs just need to find that sweet spot where things feel natural and not shoved down your throat. Like durability should only drop ONLY when you use item, when you taking damage, or die. Something that makes sense to player, not of that FireFall stage where all your gear were taking durability hit just because you were in combat, and weren't even taking damage.
To tag alone on the durability and players bitching about losing their stuff. I really liked when in FF your weapon had a presitage building up and then you could salvage it for a reward. That is pretty nice little mechanic that eased the pain, like hey your destroying your old and beaten up weapon, but it served you well and here is a reward for doing this. This is a good stuff, I can totally see durability working if properly scaled, and back up with good mechanics like that.
There should be slow rotation of resources in this game to keep the gameplay going. We dig resources up, we build things, we use that to dig more resources to build bigger things. There got to be a break somewhere in this ideology, otherwise we are going to hit wall very very fast, especially with a game that is planning on been crowd funded.
Stuff needs to break, stuff needs to be destroyed by the enemies, that will slow down the "top gear" wall. Devs just need to find that sweet spot where things feel natural and not shoved down your throat. Like durability should only drop ONLY when you use item, when you taking damage, or die. Something that makes sense to player, not of that FireFall stage where all your gear were taking durability hit just because you were in combat, and weren't even taking damage.
To tag alone on the durability and players bitching about losing their stuff. I really liked when in FF your weapon had a presitage building up and then you could salvage it for a reward. That is pretty nice little mechanic that eased the pain, like hey your destroying your old and beaten up weapon, but it served you well and here is a reward for doing this. This is a good stuff, I can totally see durability working if properly scaled, and back up with good mechanics like that.
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Likes:
Daynen
That's is the problem. Peeps just wanna pew-pew with no worries at all and then suddently they say - there is nothing left to do here, I quit. *jackie chan face*
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Likes:
OziriusSVK
Remember guys. Ember will feature horizontal progression. There is no "Top notch" stuff. Progression is about unlocking more options, not inherently better ones.
But as I explained earlier in the thread: Gear will take damage and need resources repair but will not perma-break. However there will be various other things such as buildings and assorted call downs that can and will be destroyed that will serve as the thing that needs to be built and rebuilt indefinitely.
But as I explained earlier in the thread: Gear will take damage and need resources repair but will not perma-break. However there will be various other things such as buildings and assorted call downs that can and will be destroyed that will serve as the thing that needs to be built and rebuilt indefinitely.
Likes:
Luisedgm
If gear gonna take damage when you're using it or getting hit - this could do the job. But if it will be standard WoW-like "x% gear dmg upon death" there will no actual impact.
Yet still perma-break could rly sustain replayability. Once peeps get the best stuff usually they quit. I know, a lot off them hoarding that stuff/money and losing it is their worst nightmare but you know, it reminds me of Scrudge McDuck. Items/cash in the name of items/cash. It's more fun when you're always have to chase over something.
Yet still perma-break could rly sustain replayability. Once peeps get the best stuff usually they quit. I know, a lot off them hoarding that stuff/money and losing it is their worst nightmare but you know, it reminds me of Scrudge McDuck. Items/cash in the name of items/cash. It's more fun when you're always have to chase over something.
Likes:
Daynen