DevTracker

[Ronyn]

I don't mind things like that, if it is something everyone agrees to going in.

Unfortunately the "Everyone agrees to" aspect isn't a viable option.
That is not likely to happen on anything, let alone something like this.

Although what is flagged and why it is flagged is always something that is going to be a focus point for me if I can't understand the logic behind it.

That's the thing. Different people have such different view points on stuff, we aren't always going to understand the logic behind someone else choice.

Offering a variety of toggle options is trying to give as much variance in choice as possible.

 

[Ronyn]

Let me go ahead and speak for myself for a minute.
I play lots of games where skins are for sale. I buy a whole lot, I mean a whole lot, of skins.
I do it because I like to see my character to look a certain way. I even swap skins based on my mood or character build. I fill out all tabs on the visuals menu when I can. I am seriously into this.
I like to walk around in MMO's and have people compliment my outfit. Oh yeah, I do.
I am literally the kind of customer that makes games rich for having cool visual options.
Now then, do I care whether other people were to see my character as just the base version of it...
not really. I am happy enough that I look the way I want to when I look at myself.
Is it more fun if other people see it? Yes, as I said the compliments are nice. But is it so dire that I won't buy skins if some percentage of other people can opt to not see it? nope. Cause I still get to look at my character looking the way I want them to. That's just me though. I'm allowed to feel this way.
I understand other folks will feel differently.

TLDR
To recap. I whale for skins. While I enjoy when other people see my custom character, don't care that much if other people don't see it.

choosing to censor how players look also like censor free speech.

YOU choosing not to see me in my awesome custom skin is not censoring ME from seeing myself in my awesome custom skin. When you can change my outfit on my screen we can talk about censorship, until then... You are actually talking about you being able to make me see something.

I ....

So then, we are coming to the end of this. Cause if you can't stay on point I'm going to just remove myself from the discussion and let it be whatever it is. lol

Ok how do I put this.
Honestly everything you said is just another version of what you already said, that I already countered. You're still talking around the issue, and adding new layers of fluff.
With the latest post you've added the assumption that we don't have any analytics to support this kind of tool-for-parents feature (for example: how things like blood/sweat toggle effect a games sales), you suggest that offering tools is controlling how parents do their job (when it is LITERALLY THE OPPOSITE of that), you ignore the other reason people may not want to see certain skins (like keeping the visuals lore accurate) and you play the victim like you aren't allowed to say you don't like a feature. Which, again, I acknowledged that not everyone will like it, and that is ok. You are allowed to not like it.

What are you really saying?
This boils down to you want EVERYONE else, to see your character the way you want them to.
You don't want anyone to be able to be able to even play the game, unless they have to see your character the way you made it. Doesn't appear to matter to you what percentage of people would even use the feature, nope. (cause it would likely be pretty small, historically it's the option of stuff like this that has more impact than the use of it) According to you, EVERYONE has to see your character whether they like the lore breaks, the super sexy, or whatever. You paid for those skins, other people seeing the skins brings value to you personally, if those other people feel value comes from games where they have more tools to make their own choices on what they see, you don't care. EVERYONE's gotta see your custom character.

That's fine. You can take that stance. You're allowed to feel that way.
Now YOU have to understand that other folks will feel differently.

Which brings me, once again, to the same old point.
No feature is perfect for every preference.

 

[Ronyn]

I'm against it because...

Ok Here is what the feature is-
Person A chooses what they look like.
Person B chooses whether they see anything beyond basic gear.

That means a few important things-
Censorship is not the issue because no one else is deciding what you see.

Word Filters in games are very different. As they prevent a words actual use, not simply whether a person can choose, for themselves, to opt out of seeing it.

How much nudity makes this a good or bad feature is subjective, what may be viewed as too nude for one person, could be different for another. So who chooses what's too much and what is not? You?

And yes, some games do overtly sexy outfits without filters so you either play the game and see it, or you don't play at all. Great.

We plan to offer the filter so people can choose for themselves to play the game and see the sexy outfits or not, based on their personal choice.

To argue against this feature, you have to make the case why person A should get to make person B look at what they are wearing. That's it. That's the argument you have to provide.

 

[Ronyn]

When it comes to parenting, it is up to the parents to check the PEGI/ESRB rating, some parents don't care to check and some kids also don't care what their parents say. Whatever happens in other families is out of your and anyone else's control. Besides, this game is not rated, and Grummz has stated that he does not intend to aim for a specific age.

When it comes to parenting, it's up to the parent to use the rules provided. Whether that is avoiding purchasing the bike, or putting on the training wheels.
Each parent decides for themselves what methods to employ, just as each products manufacture decides what tools to offer.
This is not something you get to decide for everyone else.

NOTE: As for what Grummz has stated. I would like to remind you that the main reasons I mentioned what this feature is for were from him. Em-8er isnt aimed at a specific age so much as meant to be played by many ages. That's kinda the idea...

If you guys want to "filter" out the lewd stuff you can do so with a "Streamer Mode", which covers the lewd stuff so you guys don't get your streamers demonetized or banned from their platforms playing your game. But if I want to color my Feli skin different, mix-match some pieces in that skin, you should NOT allow others to disable what I created.

So you accept streamer mode as something will prevent certain people from seeing your creation?
Why is that different? They either see what you made or they don't.

You guys want to force us to thump and craft, the whole resource-cycle to get better gear and progress in the game... How is this forceful behavior OK but ones money spent wanting to be presented as paid for, is not??? That's a 100% double standard, and corrupt.

That's a false equivalent.
Every game, by it's very nature, forces you to take part in some activity.
If you don't want to drive anything, don't pick up a driving game. If you don't want to shoot at things, don't pick up a shooter.
The basic concept of a game is that it requires you to do something in order to play it.
Suggesting that means we can't then offer choices in other aspects without it being a double standard is ridiculous.

Y
How come World of Warcraft doesn't have a button to turn off graphics for everyone in Transmog gear? How come Path of Exile doesn't have such a button? APB never had it, Planetside doesn't have it, Perfect World never had it... How come every single game I can think of doesn't have this button?

This is indeed a unique feature. First time I've ever seen it.
We can't know for sure how well it go over.

Most probably because it's stupid and devalues peoples money spent...

Don't screw around with my money! If I want the world to see my character for what I've made it into, don't take that away from me.

I already covered this point. Just as it makes you feel your money is devalued, it will make some others feel their money is more valued. You're allowed to have your own preferences, but speaking for others will not get you anywhere.

Remember, you are free to not spend any money on skins in this game.

You should really stop with going beyond the scope of the point here...
You don't like it. We get it. That's cool. Most of the rest of this is not helping your case.

 

[Ronyn]

My views on things like this is the same as my view on censorship. And that being who chooses what is suppressed or prohibited and what are their reasons for doing so.

hmmmmmm
I don't understand if you're saying you are fine with the toggle thing or not fine with the toggle thing.