DevTracker

[Ronyn]

So here I've been giving you the reasons to remove it

You provided exactly one sensical reason why we should remove it: This toggle stuff makes you personally feel like it devalues your purchase of the skin, and you suggest other people might feel the same. Which, again, we respect that, and as I stated IF and when many others express the same feeling we then have reason to reexamine it.

I get that you guys made a choice, now I'm asking why this choice was made. You clearly have NOT stated why other than randomly picking one side over the other without reasoning.
........... yet nobody can give me a straight answer for why it should still be there.

Incorrect.
Your original post in this thread asked the question, the answer to WHY is literally in my first post.
Later you asked how it came up in the first place, then I answered that.

I'm pointing this out in case you honestly just missed it, because it is my job to make sure people get answers to game related questions. Now, do not act like you weren't answered directly, and do not ping me about it as if you weren't answered and then redirected to that answer.

 

[Ronyn]

......

Who's points are you even arguing against?... sigh. Nevermind.

Look man. You were given very clear reasoning for why we are adding it. You just don't like it/agree with it. Which is fine, but don't confuse the two things.
I have stated multiple times that people just have different stances on this issue.

I'm done.

 

[Ronyn]

Easy fix... Crixa doesn't sell frying pans or offensive looks.

What is offensive to one may not be offensive to another. It's subjective.
you know that darn well.

Grummz has made it clear that he don't care about age restrictions...

That's not exactly what he said...lol

The game's gonna be rated for what it's gonna be rated. If kids wants to play this game they're gonna find ways to play it either way. If Em8er ends up being a 16+ title, let it be a 16+ title dammit! Stop messing around with alternative options for underaged kids that won't care about the damn restrictions anyway.

You're going with "Stop giving these kinds of tools to parents because kids may get around them anyway"

Seriously?

 

[Ronyn]

Hey so...If you were to become emperor of the world would you outlaw things like tinted glasses/windows, Kaleidoscope glasses, certain stain glass windows and stretchy mirrors because they allow people to alter their personal view of existing objects?

@punkbuzter#6186

Whether there is technically an aspect of decentralization involved is not relevent to the actual point here. If a skin buyers goal is to have their skin seen by others, then the percentage of people who will see that skin continues to matter overall. I understand we have some hardliners, like yourself, who has taken the "EVERYONE MUST SEE IT" stance, but at this time there is no evidence that is a widely held stance.
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Yes, any data we have from the current fanbase is subject to change when we have a much larger fanbase. It could swing in a way where people agree with you, it could swing in a way you're even more in the minority, or this topic could turn out to be barely spoke of at all. Still, we have to use the current feedback, along with our design goals, and statistics from the history games, to come to decisions for what we should act on right now. Predictions are based on logic, data and experience, but they are not infallible. Yet, we obviously have to use them, we obviously have to pick a direction. Otherwise it would be literally impossible to for a new company to develop a new IP.
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And to answer the "Who asked for this feature?". No one asked for this specific feature in itself, this feature was brought about as a solution to the various disagreements in the community on what kind of visuals/styles/sexiness level the skins should have. When there are different desires, sometimes the only option is to go hard to one side, sometimes you can look for options to work for more than one preference.

Much like how years ago, the firefall devs couldn't decide whether the game would be first or third person, so they decided to let it be something that people could toggle between at will. BTW, not everyone was happy about that choice either. A few people actually complained that players shouldn't be able to make the choice between first and third person view at will. It's kinda like...
There will always be at least some folks who disagree with just about any feature. Now where have I heard that before.....

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We get it, you don't like the feature. You've explained how you feel about it and you have been heard. Your "arguments", such as they were, express your feeling toward the matter and we accept it.
Your stance is noted and respected. That is about the end of that.

Now, if we get a bunch of voices also proclaiming they have a problem with the feature, that is when we have reason to reconsider it. Until then.....

 

[Ronyn]

I see what you are saying, I just don't understand it. ....

Oh ok so by "everyone agrees" you just mean that people should be made aware of it up front, so they know what they are signing up for, and then they are effectively agreeing to it by signing in.
In that case we should be good. This toggle aspect was revealed years ago. It's mentioned in the F.A.Q., and we will make certain it's clear for people when they sign up.

That said, it could be argued that we need to make sure it's more well known to people when they go to buy skins. That is something I can take a closer look at.

If you're going to decentralize fashion, and provide players with the power to remove other player's design choices, then there's no point in buying fashion because I can do it for free client-side.....

Do not confuse "No point for you" with " no point for anyone else"

Ok. So your argument is that, if even a some small percentage of the player base uses the option to not see certain skins, this has "Decentralized fashion".
At what percentage of people using this toggle does that "decentralization of fashion" take effect? 1 percent? 5 percent? 10 percent?

If 90 percent of people aren't using the toggle, is fashion still decentralized? cause that's still a whole lot of people who would still see it. Unless, again, you want to keep insisting that EVERYONE has to be forced to see your custom character.

Question is, are you ready to fight against the modding community?

We can't actually stop certain stuff that modders will do client side.
The only question we have to ask is whether we are providing enough value to enough people to buy skins to make them effective money makers to keep the game running. Considering how many people are fine or even happy with this toggle feature so far, we have no reason to think that'll be a problem.

Or, you keep the button and deal with the problems you create. Waste your resources into defending a button instead of making developments to the game. I'm sure the community would approve knowing their money spent is going to such trivial matters instead of fixing bugs for example...

How do you define what is Trivial?
When putting in a feature, devs have to compare the workload it takes to put in, with the potential sales/earnings it will create. Based on previous trends in these kinds of choice based options, it is more likely to be a benefit to the games overall success than a hinderance.