Repost from General Discussion since I was told to put it here

[Jooba]

Wasn't Mark Kern the reason Firefall fell apart after it's update changing the game from the skill tech trees to whatever came after? I was an avid supporter and a Founder before the update (can't remember version number) and I loved the game inside and out. I played for hours a day, and it brought back the sense of exploration and awe I had when I first started playing World of Warcraft back in 2005. It was THE game I wanted. I opened dozens of bug reports and was very active on the forums.

Over the ensuing months after that update, I remember seeing all over the forums the problems that upper management was causing, and ended up seeing that Mark Kern had been removed from the company by The9. It was stated that he was the core of the issue of the changes, and after he left it did get better for a little while. Gameplay was fun again with new updates, the first release of the open Beta was fun, especially with the number of players that were logging in.

So my question is, why should I trust Mark Kern this time? It was stated he ruined the game I was so excited to have, and dumped money into in order to help development. Why would this game end up being different? Doesn't anyone remember what happened to Firefall all those years ago?

Here is a link of a presumed former Red 5 employee: https://www.reddit.com/r/Games/comm...oved_as_ceo_by_red_5/?st=ir56fg93&sh=5c1f0b3f

Edit: Fixed some timeline issues and added links

 

[Grummz]

I'll let other speak, but I'll say this. I fought the changes for 3 months. But the management team insisted on changing the game more and more. The biggest lie that was ever told was when they blamed me for the changes with a straight face, after I kept saying "no" for 3 months.

 

[Jooba]

But the only evidence we have is that it was your fault. There is nowhere else that says otherwise. If there was, I guarantee the Firefall playerbase would have stood up and left as well, but almost all of them agreed with the decision and were excited to see how the game would improve. This isn't about your dismissal from the game, this is about the sorry state that Firefall was in, and the evidence showing that it wasn't The9's fault and asking if it's worthwhile to support you again.

Also, you probably should speak for yourself since this IS about you. I won't be listening to forum posters or gamers unless they have definitive evidence that all of that stuff was a lie.

 

[TankHunter678]

You need to remember that for a Chinese company like The9 hiring shills to destroy the reputation of people who were not yes men is a pretty normal thing. Just like they hire shills to try to massively bloat the reputation of a game to try to scam companies out of their money in licensing fees.

Also if you want to see evidence contrary to the claims just take a look at what happened after he left:

The gameplay changes never stopped, rework after rework after rework. The game went through what, 4 major reworks after Mark left?

Red5 staff were barely getting paid and were threatened with lawsuits if they did not stay quiet after they broke NDA to complain about not getting paid, "inspired" by the guy who broke NDA to make the very reddit post you linked. Only for that same person who made that post come back and tell all the other employees to shut up, obey the NDA, and do what The9 tells them regardless of the paycheck.

Every single CEO after Mark "disappeared" from Red5. Employees were dropping left and right citing upper management issues on the glassdoor reviews. All of the high skill employees jumped ship.

There is also the fact that after Mark Kern left a sizable chunk of the company also left.

Marketing for Firefall practically died, with every patch more of the community expressed dissatisfaction.

The population for the game steadily bled off at an unsustainable rate. Even with STEAM the population bled faster then it could grow.

A large rework of the game was announced leading to a 9 month content drought. That same rework also had core people working on it fired so the combat system they spent 8 months working on was scrapped. A new combat system was hurriedly made and not tested before it was released. The Crafting system was scrapped and last we knew they were working on bringing the old crafting system back since they scrapped the completed crafting system that was made for the rework.

Leading to the terrible broken 1.6 patch, followed by a buggy 1.7 patch that sparked everything lead up to Mark eventually putting out his desire to buy the Firefall IP, the eventual counter announcement that The9 was not willing to sell the IP intending to take it to mobile and console, and the whole start of this Ember project.

You ask "Why should I trust Mark Kern this time?"

I ask "Why did you believe The9 the first time?"

Its rather amazing how I thought The9 basically gave Red5 freedom for so many years until I read the interviews during the Mark wants to buy the IP period of time where it turns out that The9 was very active in the development of Firefall. Intending to make it look like the next big WoW so they could rack in millions in licensing fees.

 

[DARKB1KE]

But the only evidence we have is that it was your fault. There is nowhere else that says otherwise.

You must not have any clue how NDA's work (Non-Disclosure Agreements). They are legal obligations that prevent former employees from speaking about certain things within a company and for several years afterwards.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-disclosure_agreement

He legally could not respond to any accusations against him. This is how the internet works, little cowards hide behind their computer monitors and write up shill articles against him with no retaliation or repercussions, because they never disclose their full name.

It would be a different story if these guys publicly used their real names.

You honestly believed an article written on reddit from a guy never proven to be an employee? Don't believe everything you read on the internet. Ask questions, get involved.

 

[Brezals]

But the only evidence we have is that it was your fault. There is nowhere else that says otherwise. If there was, I guarantee the Firefall playerbase would have stood up and left as well, but almost all of them agreed with the decision and were excited to see how the game would improve. This isn't about your dismissal from the game, this is about the sorry state that Firefall was in, and the evidence showing that it wasn't The9's fault and asking if it's worthwhile to support you again.

Also, you probably should speak for yourself since this IS about you. I won't be listening to forum posters or gamers unless they have definitive evidence that all of that stuff was a lie.

There was a huge uproar from community, specially from the old veterans who played since 2011, and almost all of them left or had already left when Mark Kern was let go. This was one big reason you may have seen positivity about the changes when they happened, and Mark was let go, becuase we had already said what we had to say, months prior to it.

And it is true that Mark never showed openly that he was against the decisions. I think he couldn't express opinion on that as the CEO of the company.

 

[PCMasterReece]

You must not have any clue how NDA's work (Non-Disclosure Agreements). They are legal obligations that prevent former employees from speaking about certain things within a company and for several years afterwards.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-disclosure_agreement

He legally could not respond to any accusations against him. This is how the internet works, little cowards hide behind their computer monitors and write up shill articles against him with no retaliation or repercussions, because they never disclose their full name.

It would be a different story if these guys publicly used their real names.

You honestly believed an article written on reddit from a guy never proven to be an employee? Don't believe everything you read on the internet. Ask questions, get involved.

I will say while I agree with everything that you said. TheEscapist and Reddit's /r/Games subreddit both verified that BrutalWhimsy did work for Red5. Mark even agrees that BrutalWhimsy most likely worked there, Whether it was just one person or a group of people is another question. It could of been a few disgruntled employees that didn't like Mark and felt like slandering him or it could of been a shill. Either way it was a stupid thing to do and The9 know look foolish because of the way things have gone.

 

[Vecchio]

Mark made some mistakes, the Magic Bus for one, but his vision for the game wasn't a mistake. I ranted long and hard against The9 because I knew that they would kill the game based on what I read about their other gaming ventures. Let's let bygones be bygones and all start fresh here. We have a new game to build and a community to develop. I, for one, am so looking forward to playing EMBER as it progresses to Alpha. Cheers!

 

[DemonSlayer873]

Mark made some mistakes, the Magic Bus for one, but his vision for the game wasn't a mistake. I ranted long and hard against The9 because I knew that they would kill the game based on what I read about their other gaming ventures. Let's let bygones be bygones and all start fresh here. We have a new game to build and a community to develop. I, for one, am so looking forward to playing EMBER as it progresses to Alpha. Cheers!

The bus was everything but a mistake, if the manufacture didnt fuck it up it was going to save the company lots of money

 

[Vecchio]

The bus was everything but a mistake, if the manufacture didnt fuck it up it was going to save the company lots of money

Even an old dog like me can fall for propaganda. I stand corrected.

 

[Torgue_Joey]

Wasn't Mark Kern the reason Firefall fell apart after it's update changing the game from the skill tech trees to whatever came after? I was an avid supporter and a Founder before the update (can't remember version number) and I loved the game inside and out. I played for hours a day, and it brought back the sense of exploration and awe I had when I first started playing World of Warcraft back in 2005. It was THE game I wanted. I opened dozens of bug reports and was very active on the forums.

Over the ensuing months after that update, I remember seeing all over the forums the problems that upper management was causing, and ended up seeing that Mark Kern had been removed from the company by The9. It was stated that he was the core of the issue of the changes, and after he left it did get better for a little while. Gameplay was fun again with new updates, the first release of the open Beta was fun, especially with the number of players that were logging in.

So my question is, why should I trust Mark Kern this time? It was stated he ruined the game I was so excited to have, and dumped money into in order to help development. Why would this game end up being different? Doesn't anyone remember what happened to Firefall all those years ago?

Here is a link of a presumed former Red 5 employee: https://www.reddit.com/r/Games/comm...oved_as_ceo_by_red_5/?st=ir56fg93&sh=5c1f0b3f

Edit: Fixed some timeline issues and added links

soooo, let me get this right
Mark fucked up a game -> company boot Mark -> company continuous to ruin a game even more without restoring it to it previous state BEFORE it got ruined?

<sarcasm> wow, total legit </sarcasm>

 

[DARKB1KE]

I will say while I agree with everything that you said. TheEscapist and Reddit's /r/Games subreddit both verified that BrutalWhimsy did work for Red5. Mark even agrees that BrutalWhimsy most likely worked there, Whether it was just one person or a group of people is another question. It could of been a few disgruntled employees that didn't like Mark and felt like slandering him or it could of been a shill. Either way it was a stupid thing to do and The9 know look foolish because of the way things have gone.

Says who though? They never released his real name. That's not solid enough proof. He's a coward.

 

[NitroMidgets]

I wondered why when we had the trip to Red5 that The9 had Mark not there to meet us. Likely they wanted to keep up the outward appearances. The things we saw posted up on the walls, the things some of the staff said while we were there looked like it wasn't changing directions when in fact The9 had already made that decision. I wonder what Mark would have said and why James was acting as though he was the CEO and not Mark.
There was an obvious clique vibe there with some of the people. It eventually made sense that there was more going on behind the scenes. After Mark left, they blamed him but continued down the path that they said Mark was for rather then those in charge after his exit, we all knew that was total bullshit.