What games you feels the should play while making Ember?

[Omnires]

Like the title says what games do think the devs should play while creating this game?
I vote for Deus Ex (the first one) it is an old game but still within my personal top 10 games of all time.
I also vote for games in the Armored Core series of games. I would suggest playing Armored Core 4 as I personally feel it better than 5. But really customization and balance of all the mecha parts in that game series is just great.

Also in terms of mecha games when I'm not sniping I'm doing melee. So I like being able to have lots of speed and agility both to dodge attacks and to make my own attacks. Like this guy for example. In Armored Core you can make mecha with Over Boost on them, is like after burn but can be used freely.

 

[TankHunter678]

A friend of mine says that Mark should go play Armored Core 2 and 3, as they are basically the pinnacle of the armored core series before it became overtly focused on speed in AC4 and AC4FA.

 

[Vladplaya]

Deus Ex, although great games, is like completely different genre from what we are going for in Ember... Completely.

And that armored core video, oh boy, I hope Ember is nothing like that at any point in its development.

I can't even suggest a decent game for them to play to get the ideas from, just make it like FireFall before the release, and then we will go from there haha

 

[TankHunter678]

And that armored core video, oh boy, I hope Ember is nothing like that at any point in its development.

That is Armored Core 4 in a nutshell, a lot of people hated Armored Core 5 because they considerably slowed down the game to the PS2 speed levels. Resulted in a lot of people comparing it to Chromehounds.

The reduction in speed brought back tactical gameplay over pure twitch. People could no longer run in with just a blade and a mech designed to pretty much perma overboost.

 

[Omnires]

Armored core 3 is great, I like it better than 4. And personally I always like the EO (Exceed Orbit) cores more than the OB (Ober Boost) cores. I'm an offensive focus player in games so I don't have need of extra armor if I can dodge attacks and in small enclosed areas Over Boost is pointless. I hated that they removed the EO cores from the series after 3.

For the people who don't know:
Exceed Orbit (EO) cores contain one or more orbital pods that can be deployed to hover above the AC and retracted at will. They automatically target and shoot enemies. The rate of fire, power, and field of vision for EO pods varies from model to model. For EO pods with energy weapons, the ammunition supply gradually regenerates when not in use. Two important factors that limit Exceed Orbit usage are the small amounts of added heat that occur whenever an EO pod is deployed, as well as the energy drain from the pod firing. EO Cores with solid ammo do not suffer from an energy drain while firing but their ammo cannot be replenished once depleted.

 

[Hybelkaninen]

Hmmm.....Unreal Tournament 2004 and Chaser maybe

Never played it myself, but I heard the game "Dirty Bomb" fused old school and modern FPS gunplay pretty good.

 

[Vladplaya]

Even though we will be inside a mecha in Ember, I think the objective is to make that mecha feel like it's a character, and not a vehicle. Mark said multiple times that omni frame will move like character in FireFall.
So I think Armored core it's just wrong series to get ideas from. It seems to me that other than having mecha (and very different type of mecha compared Ember, at that), it has little similarities with the gameplay that we will see Ember.

It's like you can't compare FireFall with Armored Core, at all. So take FireFall and replace your character with slightly bulkier character that looks like a mecha, but moves the same. It's still would be a far cry from the Armored Core series.

Which is good, I don't want Ember to be like Armored Core at all.

 

[MattHunX]

That is Armored Core 4 in a nutshell, a lot of people hated Armored Core 5 because they considerably slowed down the game to the PS2 speed levels. Resulted in a lot of people comparing it to Chromehounds.

The reduction in speed brought back tactical gameplay over pure twitch. People could no longer run in with just a blade and a mech designed to pretty much perma overboost.

Pff... LOL

"Chromehounds"

Now, there's a nickname for the Tsihu, for the naming contest. Or ash-hounds. Or they might have some domesticated fighting animals, besides their alternate forms, that are similar to hounds. *shrug*

 

[MattHunX]

I just installed Blacklight Retribution, after reading about the balance in it, and that F2P can remain competitive with the modding system. Gonna try it out.

 

[TankHunter678]

Even though we will be inside a mecha in Ember, I think the objective is to make that mecha feel like it's a character, and not a vehicle. Mark said multiple times that omni frame will move like character in FireFall.
So I think Armored core it's just wrong series to get ideas from. It seems to me that other than having mecha (and very different type of mecha compared Ember, at that), it has little similarities with the gameplay that we will see Ember.

It's like you can't compare FireFall with Armored Core, at all. So take FireFall and replace your character with slightly bulkier character that looks like a mecha, but moves the same. It's still would be a far cry from the Armored Core series.

Which is good, I don't want Ember to be like Armored Core at all.

Mechas feel like a character by virtue of the how the pilot operates it and how the pilot customizes it. Every mecha becomes an outlet for the personality of the one using it. Which in turn humanizes the mecha.

Then again, that's how Japanese treat their mechas. Americans, well ones who are not fans of Japanese mecha, treat them as just machines. Even though they still ultimately reflect a pilots personality in how they are used and what they are equipped with.

Its why when you go and look for humanoid mecha shows... the ones that keep coming and having big followings all have japanese influences and also why the japanese are considered the masters of mecha.

Armored Core is a good series to take ideas from due to the fact that its biggest draw is its customization. Which consumes far more of a players time then actually running the missions. The missions are kinda only there to get you money and let you test your mech in combat so you can fine tune it even more. The entire series is a case of diagonal progression up to a plateau of horizontal progression. Given the extend at which the community wants their customization its a good series to look to for how to give the omniframe customization.

In terms of the rest... because the omniframe leans more on Mecha then power armor people look at it and expect the things common to a mecha game.

Certain character/vehicle designs are associated with certain genres. The more mecha it is, and the more core it is to gameplay, the more mecha genre expectations will rise up.

Only way to get from mecha suggestions, which all point to the enclosed vehicles that Mark says are too dehumanising which mecha fans will say he is wrong about that, is to redesign the Omniframe or make the omniframe not the core means of fighting.

Make the players fight on foot and call in omniframes as something special, like an ultimate response to how much firepower is needed. Much like how the Engineer called down a large manned turret.

 

[MattHunX]

Mwhaha. Couldn't wait to get rid of that huge, fugly anti-personnel turret. Unfortunately, the Electron's Electrical Storm HKM has been nerfed to hell.

 

[Ronyn]

I want to remind everyone that design inspiration can come from a great many sources. Grummz has mentioned that he got the idea for thumpers from the sci fi novel Dune, he has mentioned that Embers base building will be like the console RTS halo wars. Obviously that doesnt mean that Ember will feature a story like Dune or be an rts like halo wars. Grummz, like any creative, simply takes the bits of inspiration from where he finds it and applies it in the way it fits his overall idea.

A game like deus Ex might provide some ideas on technology,abilities, or narrative where a game like armored core might inspire a few things with mech part breakdowns or something minor about airborn interactions for all we know. Or maybe not. Either way we need not fear that finding some ideas in any one game would shift Ember towards it as a whole.

That in mind it may help to point out a specific thing you'd like the dev team to take note of or avoid from any particular property so they know what you are suggesting.

Remember it's all Just source material. To take and leave as they will. Kind of like a salad bar. Lol.Just something to keep in mind during these kinds of discussions. Carry on.

 

[TankHunter678]

Mwhaha. Couldn't wait to get rid of that huge, fugly anti-personnel turret. Unfortunately, the Electron's Electrical Storm HKM has been nerfed to hell.

Now imagine if instead of calling down the Anti-Personnel turret the Engineer instead called down a mecha like the omniframe with the anti-personnel turret guns on one arm, shoulder missile launchers, an anti-tank gun on the other arm, and replaced the Engineers abilities with mecha exclusive ones, but the Engineer had to make the most of the suit because it would have limited ammo that cannot be refilled by ammo packs and has like a say... 3-5 min operational time limit before it gets recalled.

 

[MattHunX]

I want to remind everyone that design inspiration can come from a great many sources. Grummz has mentioned that he got the idea for thumpers from the sci fi novel Dune, he has mentioned that Embers base building will be like the console RTS halo wars. Obviously that doesnt mean that Ember will feature a story like Dune or be an rts like halo wars. Grummz, like any creative, simply takes the bits of inspiration from where he finds it and applies it in the way it fits his overall idea.

A game like deus Ex might provide some ideas on technology,abilities, or narrative where a game like armored core might inspire a few things with mech part breakdowns or something minor about airborn interactions for all we know. Or maybe not. Either way we need not fear that finding some ideas in any one game would shift Ember towards it as a whole.

Just something to keep in mind during these kinds of discussions. Carry on.

Take the best from everything, and roll them together.

 

[MattHunX]

Now imagine if instead of calling down the Anti-Personnel turret the Engineer instead called down a mecha like the omniframe with the anti-personnel turret guns on one arm, shoulder missile launchers, an anti-tank gun on the other arm, and replaced the Engineers abilities with mecha exclusive ones, but the Engineer had to make the most of the suit because it would have limited ammo that cannot be refilled by ammo packs and has like a say... 3-5 min operational time limit before it gets recalled.

Well...

I...wouldn't have used it. Wouldn't have been appealing. Mammoths and Rhinos were (and are) bulky enough for me.

But, I can adapt to a fully customizable, (optionally) fully-enclosed mech that has speed and maneuverability.

 

[Squid Boss]

The Division - Character development THEORY - NOT execution. (Classless Character Building)
The Borderlands series - Obvious reasons.
Doom (2016) - Movement and Weapon modification style and that sweet, sweet, No Reload tho...
Loadout - Weapon Customization
Fallout - Weapon Customization + Perks (Classless Character building)
Warframe - Weapon Customization/Character Customization cards.
Last but not least: Firefall, so they know what not to do.

Now, I know some will go "<Game> was horrible!" That's a perfectly good reason to look at them. We learn from mistakes. We also learn from others and follow example no matter how hard we try. Good idea is still a good idea and worth looking at to spur your own creativity or to adapt something better. I know Division will get some crap but there are things it did well that can apply and just need more work.

 

[NitroMidgets]

Don't touch The Division until October after they have released 1.4 since they have finally admitted that they fucked the game up steadily since 1.1 was released. No sense in playing until you know what is getting changed. Besides, the loot drops are still pure shit.

 

[Omnires]

I also vote for games like Thief, Deus Ex (again), and Mark of the Ninja to highlight how stealth can be done. Because good stealth is about movement, tactics, and being able to out smart others.

Also, another reason to play Armored Core games is to learn how you balance a game with lock-on and tracking weapons. As one of the things many players learn in those games is how to dodge missiles.

Do in you can use things like decoys, radar jammers, and other stuff to counter weapons that lock-on you but those things take up space and add mass. And those things are a better option for the tank-like players who have a lot of armor and can absorb damage at the cost of speed and mobility.

 

[DARKB1KE]

Brink
EVE
Skyrim
Fallout
Borderlands
Dragon's Dogma
Starhawk
Hawken
Transformers
Onechanbara Z2
Syndicate
Warhammer 40k
Bulletstorm
Metal Gear Rising Revengeance
Just Cause 2/3

 

[Estender]

Earth Defence Force 4.1
Why? Because this

Actually everyone should try it.
Why? Because EDF.