What about quests?

Vedemin

Deepscanner
Jul 27, 2016
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#1
I mean, quests are really important for me. I am a Witcher 3 player and I know what a good quest is. However from what I see, if there will be procedural generation there is no place for quests and story. That's sad. So what are you gonna do with it, devs?
 
Jul 26, 2016
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Brisbane, Australia
#2
Make sure the AI pathing doesn't get all squirrely with the terrain for the dynamic spawning open world content? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I would like to see exactly what this procedural generation for the zones really is.. are we talking No Man's Sky/Mine craft randomizing style with the Height Map?

Though I understand it saves on $$ I would much prefer hand crafted things, because it does allow for possible main story quests or more unique zone events -_-'. OCT/DTE in FF for example.
 

Aphaz

Deepscanner
Jul 26, 2016
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#4
well mark did say it's a part of crixa, so i'm guessing the story will be smt in that direction...but, yeah, i love a good quest as much as the next person so i hope there'll be story driven quests/missions
:D
 

Cadbane

Base Commander
Base Commander
Jul 26, 2016
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#5
I love the idea of questing. Should it be mandatory to get certain items, factions, etc... No.

I do not see why it can not be an additional way to earn things, not the "ONLY" way. I am lead to believe that some people want to run and gun for things, that is just their style. Some people love more immersion into the game, that can be just as rewarding yet not so shooting intensive. Hell some people do not even like to shoot things but prefer other methods, although this is a first person shooter MMO, I think it is gonna be necessary. Lets not think of how it used to work with quests, but try to redefine them and make them still part of our universe in someway.
 
Likes: Silv3r Shadow

Bl4ckhunter

Active Member
Jul 26, 2016
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#6
Make sure the AI pathing doesn't get all squirrely with the terrain for the dynamic spawning open world content? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I would like to see exactly what this procedural generation for the zones really is.. are we talking No Man's Sky/Mine craft randomizing style with the Height Map?
Though I understand it saves on $$ I would much prefer hand crafted things, because it does allow for possible main story quests or more unique zone events -_-'. OCT/DTE in FF for example.
They're not mutually exclusive, you can have handcrafted zones in a procedurally generated world, that said i don't like handcrafted very much, it allows for more quality sure, but once you've seen the same thing for 20x times it just gets boring.
 
Likes: Sik San
#7
A lot of missions are often bugged, now, in FF. Path-finding, escort targets getting stuck in the terrain or the obstacles spawned in their way by wandering encounter that happen as one moves a mission along a certain path. Enemy and ally NPC AI need vast improvement to avoid frustration and awkwardness. Also, completing a mission in more than one way should also be implemented, with secondary, even tertiary and just generally bonus objective for additional rewards. Or challenges when replaying a mission. Like using secondary weapon only. Or melee only. Or keeping one's HP above a certain threshold. Or completing mission under a set time.

The Bounty system and its rewards should definitely make a return. It would encourage people to contribute, instead of just standing around, farming while AFK. It would not eliminate that sort of behavior and people might still exploit it, not doing anything, but it could be designed in a way that it would benefit only those who actually actively participate.
 
Likes: Vedemin
Jul 28, 2016
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#8
I have yet to play a game where escort quests really work right. There might be one out there that I have not played where they do, but I have not experienced that.

I am not fond of quest type games. It breaks the immersion for me. Having a game that is dynamic with some "orders from above type missions" is okay.
 

TankHunter678

Well-Known Member
Jul 26, 2016
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#9
I would not mind if a quest was something like RnD Team Lead Dr. Zed asking me to go get some 2000 of Z Element for his new awesome gun design. Then once I deliver the resources he has the test gun printed out and has me go kill a bunch of critters to test out if it works to his specifications and if it does then I get a new weapon blueprint to make the weapon myself.

Perhaps a mission where I go work for Wiley and Scarlett clearing out a infestation of critters in Crimson Storm territory because they are stretched thin as it is (generated because a environment unit got destroyed and now a refinery is infested so its a limited event quest).

No need for escort quests or designated spawn locations for quest mobs. More like the dailies in the Amazon.
 
Jul 31, 2016
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#10
If there are gonna be any quests I hope to see the "Quality over Quantity" approach, few but well written.
Personally I HATE quests, but can understand that others want it :p
 
Jul 27, 2016
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#11
How do we feel about small stories and quests that exist independently from each other, instead of a detailed main storyline? I don't think I know enough about Crixa yet to know what kinds of stories might be told in Ember. I'm just thinking really well crafted short stories might be a good way to go.

An overarching world narrative that justifies our resource gathering and combat or whatever, and then leave it open for us to experience the world however we want.
 
#13
I would not mind if a quest was something like RnD Team Lead Dr. Zed asking me to go get some 2000 of Z Element for his new awesome gun design. Then once I deliver the resources he has the test gun printed out and has me go kill a bunch of critters to test out if it works to his specifications and if it does then I get a new weapon blueprint to make the weapon myself.

Perhaps a mission where I go work for Wiley and Scarlett clearing out a infestation of critters in Crimson Storm territory because they are stretched thin as it is (generated because a environment unit got destroyed and now a refinery is infested so its a limited event quest).

No need for escort quests or designated spawn locations for quest mobs. More like the dailies in the Amazon.
Man, I haven't even seen this Amazon area. And now they're saying it won't even return if 1.8 even happens. I'm curious about it. Also, coincidentally it is actually Wiley and Scarlett missions that are often bugged, at the escort-part, mostly.
 
#14
How do we feel about small stories and quests that exist independently from each other, instead of a detailed main storyline? I don't think I know enough about Crixa yet to know what kinds of stories might be told in Ember. I'm just thinking really well crafted short stories might be a good way to go.

An overarching world narrative that justifies our resource gathering and combat or whatever, and then leave it open for us to experience the world however we want.
Well, some of the SIN-imprint or data pads you can find scattered around FF give some pretty neat information on events and character's backstories, but apart from those, some lore and story-telling should definitely be put into side-quests as seamlessly as possible, for immersion's sake and to not break any flow.
 
#15
As long as NPCs don't walk into a pit of lava while I'm escorting them, I'm down with this.
Or run STRAIGHT towards ambushing enemies. I love it how some Chosen spawn from a cave and at least one, if not all, of my escortees make a beeline towards them. Like, what hell!? Is it opposite day? Get back here. Although, they have made escort targets invulnerable, so they cannot actually die, some, not even if they stand in lava. And it wasn't like that. I remember FF, before all the major updates, I actually had to make an effort to eliminate threats as fast as possible, before they killed my target And if they got stuck in the terrain, they were conveniently (but, very thoughtfully) arc-folded/teleported to the destination, to avoid frustration. Now, when they're stuck, one has to go back to the quest-giver and cancel, then restart the thing, or hope that they get unstuck (eventually, both of which just waste the player's time, which is especially annoying when one has a nice XP or even Reputation boost for a few minutes).
 
Likes: Vedemin
Jul 28, 2016
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spiralofhope.com
#16
However from what I see, if there will be procedural generation there is no place for quests and story.
There is quite a lot of interest in lore, so I'm sure there will be quests and story.

I think early on in development there is a lot of public talk about mechanics, then art, and story feels like an afterthought, but it was stated early on that there is a lore universe. I know book-length material has already been written on that.

I hope quests aren't limited to simple assault missions, but that's still something I'd be very interested in.

We've definitely seen how bad escort missions can be. Why they're still in any game is beyond me. The meka return mission seems more reasonable, as anything which will leap over terrain won't have pathing issues, and encounters focused around them fighting seems more fun than the escorted running into packs and getting shot at.
 

TankHunter678

Well-Known Member
Jul 26, 2016
369
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#17
Man, I haven't even seen this Amazon area. And now they're saying it won't even return if 1.8 even happens. I'm curious about it. Also, coincidentally it is actually Wiley and Scarlett missions that are often bugged, at the escort-part, mostly.
Well in the Amazon the dailies were pretty simple. On some days you had to go clear out the Amazon Hisser populations. We are talking super hissers and there were 3 types of them. Myrmidons which were highly durable, had a power ranged attack that would mulch frames that got hit by it. Hunter Hissers which were flimsy, fast, and also attacked insanely fast. If you got within melee range of one of those you would get mulched to death in 3 seconds flat. The Queen Hissers were middle range, not too tough, they did not do too much damage, they just happened to come with large packs.

After that you would take a incendiary bomb and burn out larger hisser hives, and have to prevent the hissers from putting out the fires while being hit with every single type of hisser in the game en mass.

Another one of the dailies consisted of locating the remains of a scouting team, collecting the parts of the scanner they were supposed to deploy, then deploy the scanner and hold off the chosen in order to scan the tunnel networks being used by the chosen.

There was also the salvaging runs on the UAS Vanguard that crashed in the Amazon.

If you did at least 4 epic dailies in the week then you qualified for a special daily at the end of the week. Where you would have your choice of unique chosen commander boss fight.

Besides those were more generic dailies. Headshotting chosen, retaking watch towers, etc. Sometimes a daily would come and the shard did not have that section of the map uncovered because if the chosen were allowed to take the outlying bases then the repulsor fields holding the wall back would be destroyed. So the community had to band together fighting off hordes of chosen as they get trucks full of crystite from the mining facilities (which had to be retaken from chosen often) to the bases, they also had to get repulsor parts from the storage facilities (which had to be retaken from the chosen often) and once enough of both arrived then you had another convoy you had to escort to the wall. So that you may then begin the process of piecing the repulsors together while holding off chosen attack waves.

The Amazon map itself was very much a huge swamp, and there were a lot of dangers. Chosen would setup roadblocks, there would be stealth chosen hunting parties wandering around, Myrmidons and Hunter Hissers wandered around as well in one section of the map. Chosen Assault Bot groups lurked about. The Chosen would also have snipers in multiple tree nests covering approach vectors to the storage facilities and mining facilities.

Overall, 80% of the content in the Amazon required a group of people to do, it was a difficult zone that at the time had unique enemies. All of which got implemented into the general chosen pool come 1.6.

The main downside to the Amazon was that it was just battle content. There were no mining nodes at all.

One Idea I had come up with was to expand the Amazon downward. Give us thumpers on treads to escort to go dig into ore rich sections of the tunnel network, maybe even have a raid boss in the depths. Throw in more bug type enemies against us. It would of been a change of pace and let us make more use of how good Firefall could make underground zones look good.